Why People Hate Christians.

I know this is a bit odd to put up this kind of post, especially since I am one that is a Christian, or what I would rather be known for, which is a follower of Jesus. My intent is not to merely beat up those who are my brothers and sisters, but to call them, and myself, to repentance. This post isn't exhaustive as there are many reasons historically and currently why people hate Christians. There are some solid reasons for hating us as a group, and there are some nonsense ones as well. My reason for writing this post is simply for those who call themselves Christians to contemplate what I have to say, pray on it and seek to see if there are some changes that need to take place within each of our hearts.

I believe that one of the main reasons that people hate Christians is simply found in our pride of self and lack of concern to hear other's speak. We love to hear ourselves speak, and we love to be right. We cover this with a facade of "there are absolutes and I am God's messenger." While there are absolutes, let me remind you...your knowledge isn't one. You, and I, are finite in both life span and wisdom. God is the one who is infinite in both time and wisdom. It becomes so bad that when speaking to people about honest concerns over how we show people Jesus, my own brothers and sisters would rather make "sound bytes" and "be right" than try and learn from one another and truly glorify God in our humility. Humbleness and meekness have lost it's luster in the Christian walk and have been hijacked by American pride and self promotion.

Yesterday, I put up a quote that most Christians have heard before and one that always gets a reaction. This time, instead of making any commentary on the quote, I simply put it up to see what kind of reaction I would get.

"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ." -- Mahatma Gandhi

The reactions were mixed, but I knew I would get some of the reactions that we are known for. Instead of being torn up to see that maybe we need to follow Jesus more and love others more than ourselves, people decided to attack the beliefs of Gandhi. What Gandhi had to say about us should make us stumble, should make us a repentant people ready to show of Jesus. Instead, we point the finger back at the accuser. Poorly done friends.

The reality of the quote from Gandhi is just that...it is reality. We, those who follow Jesus, do a poor job of it. We should OWN this, not dismiss this. I, personally, fail so many times it is ridiculous and that is the very reason I should be the most humble, repentant person on this planet crying out for the perfection of Jesus, not the perfection or accusation of the one accusing me. We need to understand that "making a point" or "trying to find loopholes in an argument" or "being right" is not what is important. The important thing is that we need to show off more and more of the one who saved us and is continually saving us, which should cause humility, not boasting or pride.

I also wonder what right we feel like we have in the West to have these thoughts of pride and entitlement. I heard from a missiologist that out of everyone in the world, there are two places where the gospel is not growing among the people...

United States and Europe

Is this really a surprise with our pride and the love of self promotion? People are seeing right through it. One pastor put it like this:

“The Gospel came to the Greeks and the Greeks turned it into a philosophy. The Gospel came to the Romans and the Romans turned it into a system. The Gospel came to the Europeans and the Europeans turned it into a culture. The Gospel came to America and the Americans turned it into a business.”

Even Madonna is seeing through the facade...she is known for saying:

Christianity is becoming more of a currency than a belief

For those of us in business it is very easy to spot the marketing techniques churches use to promote their name, to promote who they are, to build up their followers. I continue to hear pastors brag about how much they are giving away, how much they are serving the community, how much their church is growing, etc. Then during their sermons, they rip other churches apart as though they were trying to put together a trashy political ad campaign.

Why don't we go ahead and promote Jesus, live like he did, be ready to listen first, and when we screw up admit it and ask for forgiveness from those around us?

When Gandhi tells us that he doesn't like Christians because we are nothing like Jesus, we should really take that in. We should contemplate ways in which we can change. We should look for ways in our lives that we are not living more like Jesus, instead of ripping someone else apart. When I read what Gandhi says, I should hear it like this:

I love your Christ, it's you I don't like, you are so unlike your Jesus

Then...I should first repent and look for ways to be more like Jesus and then point people to Him, not me.

When we speak first and don't care to hear the rest of the world, we are a prideful people who doesn't think we need learning. We are to be humble.

So the common man will be humbled and the man of importance abased,
The eyes of the proud also will be abased.
Isaiah 5:15

For My hand made all these things, Thus all these things came into being, declares the Lord. But to this one I will look, To him who is humble and contrite of spirit, and who trembles at My word. Isaiah 66:2

Whoever exalts himself shall be humbled; and whoever humbles himself shall be exalted.
Matthew 23:12

Being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross.
Philippians 2:8

You younger men, likewise, be subject to your elders; and all of you, clothe yourselves with humility toward one another, for God is opposed to the proud, but gives grace to the humble.
1 Peter 5:5

But He gives a greater grace. Therefore it says, “God is opposed to the proud, but gives grace to the humble.
James 4:6

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What Might A "Muslim" Gospel Culture Look LIke

Since I have been living in a Muslim culture for the last month, I started to think how would the gospel penetrate this place? It had surely penetrated this very culture 2000 years ago, certainly it could do it again. And I am positive that this is a job for the regenerating power of the Holy Spirit, but the fact remains, we (The Church) are sent into the culture as Jesus was (John 20:21) to help penetrate every culture with the gospel of the kingdom of God (Mark 1:14, 15; Matthew 28:19-20; Acts 1:8); so what's it take? I have been "Contending" for a gospel that is shaped by the cultural language in order to clearly communicate the message of Jesus Christ. Others of course have vehemently argued that this is an anathema and a compromise of Gospel truth. I will continue to contend though, that every presentation of the gospel is shaped by the cultural paradigm of the messenger. This is why there was a similar vehement argument in the first century, and the reason Paul had to write such glorious works as Romans and Galatians; to correct error, define the gospel, and exhort the church to be gracious in these culturally different movements (Romans 14:13-20).

The Jewish believers struggled greatly with the gentile believers who didn't adhere to their "Religious" traditions (Even traditions commanded by God in scripture), but the gospel spread when it was ripped from Jewish control, and was formed in pagan centers of asia-minor, Rome, North Africa, etc. There is no doubt that some syncretism resulted, but if the gospel is going to continue to move outward, it needs to be released by those that feel they own it, and trust that the Holy Spirit is still on duty (John 16:7-15; 1 John 2:27-29; 1 Corinthians 2:15-16).

Today we face similar challenges from many inside the church who believe they are the gate keepers of "truth," and foist their own culture on the gospel in the guise of gospel purity making missions to those outside their culture nearly impossible. Just the other day I was reading where a man was criticizing Rick Warren for praying to a "Merciful and compassionate God," during a prayer breakfast, because that prayer was Muslim, and catered to Islam; and although he acknowledged (Thankfully) that our God is "Merciful and Compassionate" he said it did not represent the gospel well. This is utter ridiculousness. Apart from apologetic sites trying to deny this reality, there are a plethora of verses in the bible that have been co-opted from pagan texts, and applied to Yahweh, the one true God. Like Psalm 29, which is clearly a Canaanite, or Phonecian ode to Baal. According to theologian H.L. Ginsberg, "This psalm is a Yahwistic adaptation of an older Canaanite hymn to the storm-god Baal...” has been “...corroborated by the subsequent discovery of tablets at Ras Shamra and by progress in the interpretation of these texts” (1966, 1:175). Paul himself indicates in Acts 17:28 that he quoted their poets when he wrote, "For in Him we live and move and exist...for we also are his offspring" (This was written at first about the pagan Greek god Zeus). If something is true, it is true no matter what the source is that says it, which should remind us that the culture's religions, and poets, and artists can and do speak the truth as they perceive it through general revelation. To this Calvin writes:

“In reading profane authors, the admirable light of truth displayed in them should remind us, that the human mind, however much fallen and perverted from its original integrity, is still adorned and invested with admirable gifts from the creator...Whenever we meet heathen writers, let us learn from the light of truth which is admirably displayed in their works, that the human mind, fallen as it is, and corrupted from its integrity, is yet invested and adorned by God with excellent talents. If we believe that the Spirit of God is the only fountain of truth itself, we shall not reject or despise the truth itself, wherever it shall appear, unless we wish to insult the Spirit of God.”

It amazes me that many who are quick to quote Calvin, Luther, etc. don't seem to have the intellectual integrity to think like these men. If we continue to ride into culture with our arrogant, white hats to spew our learned doctrine at the poor pagans who know no truth, we will continue to alienate billions of people from the truth of the gospel, all in the name of "Purity!"

It is quite possible that the gospel that transforms Muslim culture is going to do it as it has in any other culture and era, by the power of the Spirit regenerating hearts to respond to Jesus, and then creating the "Church" (Ecclesia) in that culture that will borrow from the sublime in the culture while discarding the chaff.

I heard a story the other day of a Muslim woman who converted to be a follower of Isa Al-Masih (Jesus the Messiah) through a series of dreams she had, and as she was meeting with a local missionary for discipleship, the Muslim woman asked, "What should I think and do about Mohamed?" The missionary woman, thought about it and said nothing, just pray to God, and let Him tell you, so the woman went home and prayed, and had a dream where she saw Mohamed in a coffin, beautifully adorned, and looking restful, and the Muslim woman concluded that God was showing her that Jesus is alive and Mohamed is in the grave. Can we still trust the Spirit of God to defend Himself, and to teach His people (Whom He loves more than we do) the truth about Himself, or are we obligated in wiping out every vestige of culture in order to replace it with our own "learned" thinking? This just makes us 'Functional Saviors" guarding the gates of our tribal god who is too weak to fend for himself.

Maybe a Muslim cultural version of the new believer may include praying five times a day, celebrating Ramadan and giving of alms, etc. but with a renewed sense of grace leading the way. Most Christians celebrate Easter and Christmas, and it is clearly known that those celebrations were very pagan; yet that's ok, since it's what "Christians" do. The way toward penetrating the diverse cultures of this world is through their own cultural stories that align in pointing to the gospel, which is as C.S. Lewis says:

“Now as myth transcends thought, incarnation transcends myth. The heart of Christianity is a myth, which is also fact (emphasis mine). The old myth of the Dying God, without ceasing to be myth, comes down from heaven of legend and imagination to earth of history. It happens-at a particular date, in a particular place, followed by definable historical consequences. We pass from a Balder or Osiris, dying nobody knows when or where, to a historical Person crucified under Pontius Pilate. By becoming fact it does not cease to be myth: that is the miracle."

Our gospel is the meta-narrative, the story of stories; the culmination of all stories which aim at the truth but fall a bit short because they lack the "Word of God" in the flesh, the direct revelation of the one true God, Jesus Christ. I pray that we work hard at presenting Jesus, and leaving the Christian religion where it belongs, in a history book.

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Interfaith Dialogue a "Tremendous Success"

Most of the readers know of the dialogue that happened at Harambee last month. I thought I would share the press release put out by CAIR Seattle in regards to the dialogue. Many friendships were made and more dialogues and get togethers are being put together for the future. It is truly exciting to see what God is doing.

Interfaith Dialogue of Evangelicals, Muslims a 'Tremendous Success'

Some 300 Participants Explore Similarities, Differences in Perspectives on Jesus

Some 300 members of a Renton area Evangelical church, a Redmond area mosque, and other local mosques and churches participated in a dialogue on the Islamic and Christian perspectives on Jesus on Saturday, March 27th at the Harambee Church in Renton, WA.

The Council on American-Islamic Relations of WA (CAIR-WA), Muslim Association of Puget Sound (MAPS) and Harambee Church, partnered to organize the event "Jesus, Who is He?" The event included a reception, presentations by leaders on the basics of each faith, readings and table discussions of relevant passages from the Bible and Qur'an, and a question and answer session.

Participants read verses from the Qur'an as well as verses from the Bible, comparing each book's accounts of Jesus' birth, descriptions of the Virgin Mary, and attributes of Jesus.

Michael Ly, a Pastor at Harambee and Vice President of Peace Catalyst International, has been a major part of interfaith work with CAIR-WA and local mosques. Ly started bringing together leaders of both faith communities through small gatherings and mosque visits, leading up to large dialogues between entire congregations. "It is truly an honor to be part of an effort to build bridges of understanding between Evangelicals and Muslims," said Ly. "I believe this is the first of many future religious and social interactions between these two faith communities."

Arsalan Bukhari, Executive Director of CAIR-WA participated in the event. "A gathering like this brings forward issues of interest to both Muslims and Christians" he said. "It is our goal to build interfaith communities through dialogue and mutual respect."

Imam Mohamad Joban, Imam (Muslim religious leader) at MAPS commented on the success of the event. "What happened this past Saturday night at Harambee Church was a bounty of our Lord," he said. It was a combination of thoughtful preparation, generous efforts by the organizers, and our trust in Allah."

Gina Mahmoud, Secretary of the Interfaith and Outreach Committee at MAPS viewed the event as a 'tremendous success.' "The event was a tremendous success and exceeded all expectations in attendance, organization and impact," said Mahmoud. "I am also very proud of the many young people of both faiths who attended."

Many future events are planned. Those interested in having their faith community involved in an interfaith endeavor are encouraged to contact CAIR-WA or Pastor Michael Ly.

CAIR-WA is the local chapter of CAIR, America's largest Muslim civil liberties and advocacy organization. Its mission is to enhance the understanding of Islam, encourage dialogue, protect civil liberties, empower American Muslims, and build coalitions that promote justice and mutual understanding.

Muslim Association of Puget Sound, MAPS, is an Islamic organization founded in 2006 with the intent of serving the Muslims of Puget Sound. Its mission is to provide Islamic educational, social and cultural services to the Muslim community in the region and to promote the teachings of Islam to the inquiring non-Muslim. MAPS strives to build links between Muslim families, businesses and organizations, provides year-round activities and religious services and is committed to helping the needy.

Peace Catalyst International exists to stimulate peacemaking between individuals and between peoples. Our mission is to catalyze peacemaking initiatives for multi-dimensional reconciliation in the way of Jesus. Two of the greatest areas of conflict in the world today are between Christians and Muslims and between the West and the Muslim world. Thus, we give special priority to these relationships.

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Audio from Muslim and Christian Dialogue

Here is the audio from the dialogue we had at Harambee this past Saturday. If you have any questions in what was said, let me know. I can also make the powerpoint that was used for Michael's part available if you want it. Just let me know. Thanks to MAPS Redmond for the following photoraphs. If you would like to see the full flikr stream, click here.

Michael's Presentation on "Who is Jesus?"

Imam Joban’s Presentation on Islam and Jesus in the Qur'an

Q&A Panel




Muslim Prayers

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My Reaction to the Muslim & Christian Dialogue

:::If you want to see more pictures of the dialogue, click here...blogger is having issues right now in uploading photos:::

Saturday night we had a dialogue at Harambee between Muslims and Christians called, "Who is Jesus?". We were not sure how popular this type of thing would be. I spoke to my friend, who is the President of Seattle CAIR, and he told me this was the first of such dialogues he has heard of between Muslims and Christians with a conservative theology church in the Northwest. There has been many dialogues or meetings between liberal churches and Muslims, but none to his knowledge with those of the historical orthodox Christian faith.

What happened was nothing short of the providence of our God. Over 250 Muslims and Christians showed up for the event. Not only that, but one of the concerns was that if we did have a big showing, that one "side" might be overwhelming in attendance with the other having little to show for. But, it felt that it was about 50/50 between Muslims and Christians. As far as the congregations from the Muslims, I know that there were at least 5 Masjids/Islamic Centers represented from the Islamic Center of Kent, Olympia, Eastside, Seattle and Muslim Association of Puget Sound. There might have been more, but these were the ones I know of. As far as churches, I know that at least 6 different churches were in attendance. There was Harambee, First Presbyterian Church of Bellevue, Oikos Fellowship, Highlands Community Church, Northshore Baptist Church and Spring of Life Slavic Baptist Church.

The evening started with Christians seeing the hospitality of our Muslim friends. As they showed up, food and more food showed up as well. There was a wedding that some attended beforehand, and they brought what seemed like all the leftover food from the wedding. My wife was with me and she was a little nervous just because she desired to be culturally sensitive and didn't want to offend those we were hosting. After helping setting up the food with some of the Muslim women, my wife's demeanor completely changed. She was very excited to be able to speak with these women, share some laughs, frustration (because of the amount of food and confusing menu items) and even made some new friendships with these women.

The fellowship beforehand was awesome, as I pretty much expected. I met many new Muslim friends, introduced many to others and saw many of my Christian and Muslim friends sharing stories and lives together. Two of the men that I met beforehand work right around the corner from me, so we are going to try and get together for lunch or coffee to extend our conversations from the evening.

After fellowship, and adding many chairs, sofas and tables for the event to house all the guests, the night continued.

Michael Ly stood up and told a couple of stories of his interactions with Muslims and how his view of Muslims changed drastically when his wife had their first baby. One of their neighbors, being a Muslim, came over and said that they knew that Michael and Shannon didn't have any family in the area and in their culture when a woman has a baby the new mother does nothing besides care for the mother for 40 days. Knowing she was in a different culture, the Muslim woman asked if she could care for her for the next week, allowing Shannon to just concentrate on the baby. This love and hospitality from the Muslim woman struck a cord with Michael and Shannon and the understanding of them challenged the Lys.

Michael went on to give his presentation on "Who is Jesus?" from the Christian perspective. The presentation was one that involved showing our understanding that whether one is a Christian, Muslim, or whatever, it didn't matter, everyone needs to know the straight path to the Kingdom of God. He then went to show how through Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses, David, Jonah and John the Baptist, God was always giving us a sign pointing to the greatest sign that was to come in the sacrifice of Jesus the Messiah. It was a clear presentation and one that was highly focused on showing more than just our beliefs, but showed how we see Jesus as the clear sign given by God from the Old Testament.

After Michael was done presenting, it was time for the Maghrib, or the prayer (salah or salat) at sunset. We cleared the bottom tier of Harambee and the Muslims prayed. It was pretty awesome to have Christians have the opportunity to see the Muslim prayers up close. Not only that, but one of the Muslim leaders gave a quick explanation of what happened afterwards and so did Imam Joban during his presentation.

After the Maghrib, it was time for Imam Joban's presentation of Islam's view of "Who is Jesus?" I have to be honest, Imam Joban's presentation, for the first 30 minutues wasn't "Who is Jesus?" but could have been titled, "What is Islam and Why Should You Trust in the Qur'an?" It was a little odd, but even so, Imam Joban was a great presenter and very funny. When he got through the first 30 minutes of trying to convince us to trust in the Qur'an (which I actually didn't mind hearing at all, just wondered if if should have been done at a different time) Imam Joban gave us some information of who Jesus is in the Islamic understanding. I felt like Imam Joban was very clear and didn't pull any punches. As one who follows Jesus, it is hard to hear what others think of Jesus, but this is always the tension in a dialogue. I am sure it was difficult for some of the Muslims to hear what Michael Ly presented as well. But, I believe the tension is fine as long as loving our God and neighbor is supreme.

After the presentations were completed, it was time for the tables to discuss what was presented or just anything of interest between the two faiths. I loved this time. Our table was one to where we were able to have conversation of our two convictions and just some questions from each faith. One of the Muslims that I met beforehand was at our table and one of the women Stacy met was at our table as well. We went through John 9 and I was able to give a quick history lesson that led to this discussion between Jesus and his disciples.

We also spoke about:

Do Christians believe Adam was forgiven? (which was because of the difference of convictions of imputation of Adam's guilt)

Do you have to be Muslim to go to heaven?

Why 5 prayers?

What is the Injeel?

What do the Muslims and Christians believe is the written word of God?

There was even an interesting discussion between a Muslim man and a Muslim woman on whether one can tell if someone loves God because of external actions. The man was trying to say he could tell, while the woman disagreed and said it is not for her to judge whether someone loved and worshiped God based on external actions that are supposed to be "common" for Muslim believers. It was interesting to hear, but was never at a point of anger in any way.

I honestly wish we could have continued, but I believe that my new friendships will allow it to continue at a later date.

Lastly came the Q&A panel. There was 4 Muslims (one a woman convert from Christianity) and 4 followers of Jesus. The questions were written on note cards, so that Michael and Imam Joban could control the content a little. Some of the questions that were answered were:

Is Jesus the Lamb of God and is He God?

Did Mohammad travel to Jerusalem and is that where he could have received his information on who Jesus is and on the information from the Bible?

How can we continue to develop friendships from other faiths?

Do those on the panel have long developed friendships from other faiths?

In Islam we don't have the idea of inherited sin. How is it fair that we have inherited sin from Adam when we weren't there?

There were other questions that I can't remember, but these were the main ones that impacted the evening. I think whether one is a Muslim or a Christian, we can all say that God/Allah was glorified and worshiped together. It was a night of peace, of new friendships and very good dialogue to help bridge the gap that stands between the two faiths. What we also found out, as a reminder, is that we definitely have points of difference in theology between us that are not to be overshadowed or forgotten. What we did show is that even with these, we can still be friends and love each other instead of being fearful or at war with one another.

This is what is important. To truly understand each other so that we can love each other. We don't have to agree on everything to call each other "friend."

I pray that each side will come away with this:

“Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?”
And He said to him, “ ‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.’
“This is the great and foremost commandment.
“The second is like it, ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’
“On these two commandments depend the whole Law and the Prophets.”

Matthew 22:36-40

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